Recently I interviewed Evan Brand, and we talked about mold-gut-thyroid connection. If you would prefer to listen to the interview you can access it by Clicking Here [1].
Dr. Eric Osansky:
I am very excited to chat with Dr. Melinda Ring. I am going to dive into her impressive bio, and then we will talk about culinary medicine.
Dr. Ring is director of Osher Center of Integrative Health and clinical associate professor, departments of medicine and medical social sciences at Northwestern University, Feinberg School of Medicine. She has an active clinical practice, directs medical trainee education, and clinical and faculty fellowships in integrative medicine. She founded the Cooking Up Health culinary medicine course and conducts research as well.
Dr. Melinda contributes to textbooks and research articles in the field of women’s health and integrative medicine. She has published several books on integrative medicine, including The Natural Menopause Solution. She is a frequent contributor to news outlets.
She is the chair of the board of the American Board of Integrative Medicine. In 2021, she received the Bravewell Distinguished Service Award from the Academic Consortium for Integrative Medicine and Health, which is one of the highest honors in the field of integrative health. Dr. Melinda, thank you so much for joining us.
Dr. Melinda Ring:
Thanks for having me. Looking forward to our conversation.
Dr. Eric:
Same here. Before we dive into culinary medicine, if you could give a little bit more of your background. How did you start focusing on that?
Dr. Melinda:
It’s an interesting question because if I think back to my childhood, I grew up in the ‘70s and ‘80s. Food was very much processed food and Wonder bread and TV dinners. That is what was healthy. I never actually learned how to cook. What we knew about nutrition was very different from what we know about it now.
I had a brief window of time between college and medical school. I begged my way into getting a job as a sous chef at a fancy restaurant in Ann Arbor. I spent the summer making salmon en papillotes, making our own sausage from scratch, and doing a lot of different things I had never learned before.
When I went to medical school, we learned nothing about nutrition. The only real nutrition we had was about IV nutrition for inpatients. Even when we were talking about diabetic patients, where it’s such a difference, we learned about how to dose insulin, but we didn’t learn how to counsel patients on what to eat.
When I was in practice, I knew to tell someone to eat a low sodium diet. Giving them a handout doesn’t translate to real-world nutrition. After my integrative medicine training, which was very nutrition-focused, as you know, I started to think about bringing those together. That’s where this idea of marrying culinary medicine, which has been defined as the art of cooking with the science and nutrition of medicine, really appealed to me. We decided to create a course for health professionals, so we can try to train more doctors, more health professionals to help their patients down the road.
Dr. Eric:
Very cool. How long have you been doing this?
Dr. Melinda:
Probably for the past eight years. We started a course at Northwestern, and now we’ve expanded it. It’s being taught at other institutions. It’s not a patient directive. I get inquiries from my own patients, “How can we take your culinary medicine class?” Right now, that’s not what we offer although there are definitely others who offer things like that. I might do that myself down the road. But right now, Cooking Up Health is aimed at making sure people’s doctors and other health professionals understand culinary medicine, so they can help their thousands of patients.
Dr. Eric:
Is it mostly other integrative doctors? Do you actually get conventional medical doctors who express interest?
Dr. Melinda:
We’re trying to start early. In a few weeks, we are starting a cohort of first- and second-year medical students. They will go into all kinds of fields. Nutrition is relevant to everything, from surgery to dermatology to primary care. It’s definitely focused on everybody, not just integrative doctors.
Dr. Eric:
Wonderful. How do you incorporate it into your actual practice? It sounds like you don’t actually teach your patients how to cook; you just encourage them to eat whole, healthy foods. Do you encourage them to use recipes?
Dr. Melinda:
To some degree. Nutrition is always a part of what I talk about to patients. Yes, providing resources for them. I tend to have a very educated, health-oriented patient population. They tend to already be aware to some degree, but it’s really diving more deeply into how to make this a practical thing in an already busy life.
We can’t do cooking that takes three hours to prepare when somebody has other things going on. When I have a patient who has two jobs and is raising kids, telling them to use this fancy cookbook to prepare food is just not gonna work. It comes down to what are some of the quick and easy ways to make healthy nutrition realistic and delicious?
Dr. Eric:
Makes sense. Batch cooking, do you recommend that?
Dr. Melinda:
Love batch cooking. Absolutely. There is a cookbook I got recently by this nutritionist cook, Love and Lemons. In it, for example, she says, “You just got organic zucchini from Costco, and you have a whole bunch of it. Here are three nights of completely different recipes you can do. You prep this on day one, and then you will use this day two and this day three.” Those are the kinds of things I think help.
They also help reduce food waste, which is such a big issue in our country. People buy all this stuff and throw it out at the end of the week because they’re starting to not look so great or are a little wilted. Helping people learn to avoid some of that food waste is important, too.
Dr. Eric:
How important is food when it comes not to just overall health, but when dealing with health conditions? You know the listeners of this podcast here pretty much consist of people with thyroid and autoimmune thyroid issues. What role would you say food plays in helping someone to recover, or from other autoimmune health conditions or conditions like cancer?
Dr. Melinda:
To me, integrative medicine always starts with lifestyle. Diet is one of those pillars of health. I love dietary supplements. I love other approaches, like acupuncture and energy therapies. Those will do very little if somebody is not also addressing nutrition, getting enough sleep, moving, managing stress, having joy in their life. It’s essential basically.
I think it’s critical both to feeling better with whatever you’re dealing with now, but also it’s one of those root cause things, which is having a healthy diet will prevent disease down the road. You have to start there.
Dr. Eric:
Good answer. I agree with that.
One question I have is picky eaters. Growing up, I always used to be really picky. Even these days, I’m still more on the picky side, but I eat more of a variety. How do you deal with picky eaters as far as someone who wouldn’t use a lot of spices to make it more flavorful? Do you have any feedback for those listening who might just want to have their burger and sides? Hopefully not French fries. “These are the five foods I’m eating on a regular basis.” Maybe it’s a vegetable or two sometimes. If you could give some advice on how they could increase the variety.
Dr. Melinda:
I have two boys. One of them is a picky eater. I think it depends on what we’re talking about. With kids, it’s a very different situation than adults.
With kids, the bottom line is you need to get those fruits and vegetables into the diet. Getting those things started early, when they’re developing a taste for it, is important. Now, I am a little bit of a purist, and maybe not the best example because I actually prefer all of my vegetables and fruits without a lot of sauces, without a lot of spices. I love them just in their natural taste, maybe steamed or roasted, but not with a lot of stuff on it.
For other people, trying to- For example, if they are pasta lovers, adding vegetables into that, even if they’re frozen, and mixing them in. Doing muffins and making them zucchini muffins and hiding it in. Finding ways to incorporate it. Smoothies are always a great way. People love to get things in that way. I don’t love the fruit and veggie blend powder type things. I don’t think they’re a replacement for real food.
It takes a while to develop a taste for something new. If somebody has been eating a very restricted diet, sometimes they have to give it a chance and say, “I am going to commit to eating this, at least three times, before I say I don’t like it.” Even if it’s one piece of broccoli, allow their taste buds to adapt and appreciate it. Maybe eat it mindfully. Notice it more. Appreciate it more.
Dr. Eric:
Those are good points. Growing up, I really didn’t eat vegetables. As an adult, I wasn’t crazy about eating vegetables. Going through chiropractic school and learning about nutrition, I realized I needed to eat healthier and incorporate vegetables. It was a slower process. A lot of it was a mindfulness around eating them and realizing how much good it’s doing to my body. The smoothies, which I still to this day incorporate into my practice. It’s best to start when you’re young.
I still come across adults, and I’m sure you do, too, where they are hardly eating any vegetables. Some listening to this absolutely love vegetables, I’m sure. When someone refuses to eat vegetables, it’s more of a challenge.
You also brought up the powders. I’ve had people bring that up, too, as a substitute. “Can I have a veggie and fruit mix powder?” Exactly what you said. I tell them the same thing. It’s probably better than nothing, but it’s definitely not the same as eating whole veggies and fruits.
Dr. Melinda:
ConsumerLab.com did a review of them. The FDA came down on them because they will make these claims like, “Has 12-14 servings in a single drink.” That’s some false marketing.
Dr. Eric:
Good to know. You said Consumer Labs?
Dr. Melinda:
ConsumerLab.com. Are you familiar with them?
Dr. Eric:
Yeah.
Dr. Melinda:
They test the quality of supplements and see what they’re supposed to have and that they don’t have things they’re not supposed to have, like heavy metals. That’s another resource I oftentimes will recommend to patients for supplements. It’s one of the better ones.
Dr. Eric:
You also mentioned as far as when you eat foods, sometimes you’ll steam them. Sometimes, you’ll roast them. Do you also eat them raw? Do you recommend a combination of raw and cooked veggies? Or is it mainly cooking?
Dr. Melinda:
I think it varies. It depends on the patient really. I don’t only see autoimmune issues. I see all kinds of things. A lot of my patients have gut issues. They may do better or worse, depending on what their situation is, with raw versus cooked.
Cooking alters the nutritional content of food. It alters its availability, sometimes in positive ways, and sometimes in negative ways. When we talk about something, for example, like goitrogens, which are a big topic in thyroid, cooking degrades them. In that case, cooking may be the preferred option versus eating a bunch of raw broccoli dipped in a dip. I don’t have a universal, I only eat cooked food. I’m certainly not a raw foodie either. I like it all. For patient tolerance, it really depends on their situation.
Dr. Eric:
That makes sense. If someone is experiencing a lot of bloating when eating salads or cruciferous vegetables, it’s probably easier, at least for the time being, to cook them. On the other hand, If someone is fine eating salads and other raw vegetables, it sounds like you just go with the flow and let them continue eating raw vegetables. Pretty much how they prefer it as long as they are able to tolerate it without any symptoms.
Dr. Melinda:
Yeah. I also am envisioning this shift to a more integrative culinary medicine movement. For example, if we think about ayurvedic medicine and how it describes people as having different doshas and different combinations of doshas, in Ayurveda. Somebody who has a Pitta, a more heated dosha constitution, may do better with raw, cooler type foods. Somebody who is more Kapha may need more cooked foods.
There are different ways of looking at food and food preparation. Looking at what’s right for someone, it’s certainly what feels good to you, but it can go even beyond that, depending on what is the lens through which we’re looking at food.
Dr. Eric:
One thing I didn’t say in the beginning: Are you a vegan, or just vegetarian?
Dr. Melinda:
I like the term “plant-forward” or “plant-based” more than vegan. That makes it sounds like I will never eat this, versus I will eat a lot of these great, lovely plants. I do have some dairy in my diet. Not a huge amount. Certainly some honey. Occasional eggs. I am not completely vegan for sure.
For me, it’s a combination of health, connection to the world, and being an animal lover. It’s a big holistic reasoning for me versus just for health.
Dr. Eric:
Okay. It’s philosophical, not just health reasons.
Dr. Melinda:
Philosophical, environmental, spiritual, you could say. I’ve done some things like shamanic journeys, and my spirit animal was this beautiful, big deer who came. I’m not eating you anymore. You can look at it in a lot of ways. I’m just very happy that science backs me up. Eating a lot of plants is a good way to go.
Dr. Eric:
I can’t say I’m vegetarian, but I do agree that you want to eat a lot of plant-based foods. I would recommend mostly plant-based. I think you would agree that if someone does choose to eat meat, like beef, it should be grass-fed beef, preferably organic. If they eat chicken, organic, maybe pasture-raised. You said sometimes you eat eggs and dairy, so I imagine when you do that, you try to eat organic. Do you prefer raw dairy, or is it just regular organic?
Dr. Melinda:
Organic, yeah. You have to be knowledgeable about the labels. Organic eggs don’t necessarily mean that they’re healthier. It doesn’t necessarily mean that the chickens had free range. You do have to be a little cautious. Unfortunately, unless you have your own chickens, those free-range options may be more expensive. That’s what I get for our family.
Dr. Eric:
You get organic, pasture-raised then?
Dr. Melinda:
Yeah.
Dr. Eric:
How about spices? I know you said for vegetables, you usually eat them plain. I would think with other-
Dr. Melinda:
I do love spices though.
Dr. Eric:
Can you talk about some of your favorite spices?
Dr. Melinda:
I’m sure you can guess what my favorites might be. Turmeric is certainly one of them. The vibrant yellow spice that comes from the curcumin longa plant. It’s been used in culinary traditions for thousands of years. It is used in Ayurveda and is used for all kinds of conditions.
One of its major constituents is that curcumin, which makes up 2-5% of turmeric, really has so many therapeutic effects. Everything from antimicrobial, protection against cancer, anti-inflammatory for sure. It helps to inhibit this NF-kappa beta molecule that turns on genes related to inflammation. Whenever we talk about inflammation and autoimmunity, curcumin is one of my top choices, and turmeric, whether it’s used in golden milk or a good curry.
Dr. Eric:
I think a lot of people are familiar with the benefits of turmeric, curcumin, even though a lot of people take it in supplement form. That has benefits, too. Therapeutic value. Including it in your food enhances the taste, and you’re still getting those therapeutic properties.
Dr. Melinda:
Another one is ginger. I love ginger. Typically, raw. It has gingerol in it. That is anti-inflammatory and antioxidant. It’s been studied more when we talk about inflammatory conditions for things like osteoarthritis more than, say, Hashimoto’s or Graves’. It’s been shown to have benefits comparable to pain medications for something like knee osteoarthritis.
I do love ginger. I use that in all kinds of ways. It might even just be taking some raw ginger and brewing it in hot water and having ginger tea. Easy to do. A. lot of people like to add some raw ginger, if they are making smoothies. It adds a little bit of a bite to it. I think it makes it a richer taste. Ginger is for sure another one of my tops.
I love cinnamon. We think about it for diabetes, blood sugar regulation. Maintaining that blood sugar is so important for lowering inflammation. Cinnamon may activate these insulin receptors and inhibit enzymes that inactivate insulin. Cinnamon, top favorite. Love it on my oatmeal and on a baked apple, on just about anything. I will highly recommend cinnamon. Those are my top three.
Dr. Eric:
Those are a good top three. As far as diet goes, there are a lot of different diets. There’s paleo, Mediterranean, carnivore, autoimmune paleo, etc. Do you have a favorite diet? Are you of the mindset that there is not a single diet that fits everybody?
Dr. Melinda:
I think that’s probably been a little bit of my hard part in terms of writing a book or doing some things. I don’t think there is one best diet, and only one diet that works for everybody. I do think that anti-inflammatory is the way to go, which means a lot of plants. That doesn’t necessarily mean no meat, but it means very little meat to me.
The diets that are more meat-heavy I would say are the only ones that I have a bit of a conflict with. I’m sure there are people who feel great when they eat a lot of meat. From my research, that’s just not the direction that I recommend patients go.
Often, patients are told not to eat gluten or dairy if you have an autoimmune disease. Don’t eat grains. Those to me get more nuanced.
Dr. Eric:
Nightshades as well are pretty common.
Dr. Melinda:
And the nightshades fall into that category as well.
Dr. Eric:
It’s a little bit different. There are health properties to tomatoes, eggplants, and peppers. Everybody is different. I’ll admit that my autoimmune patients, I tell them to at least take a break from nightshades. I don’t say to avoid them forever. There are some people who choose not to. Maybe they follow more of a paleo diet. Eat some nightshades, and they might still progress well and do okay. It’s almost like playing it safe. Let’s see how you do without them. Eventually, you have to reintroduce them.
With gluten, I know some of your thoughts because I mentioned I listened to some of your other interviews. I guess gluten, I’m more strict on. The question is does everybody need to avoid gluten forever? Is it bad if someone goes to Giordano’s in Chicago or other good Chicago pizza? Is it a bad thing every now and then to have gluten? Let’s hear your thoughts on that.
Everyone listening knows my thoughts. I tell them to avoid gluten at least while healing. Even dairy. Nightshades, definitely not as bad as gluten in my opinion. They have some good health benefits. I’d love to hear what you think. I know it’s different than what I think.
Dr. Melinda:
It may or may not be. I will often recommend it for my patients who are coming to me initially with autoimmune disease who are not feeling great, even on their optimized thyroid medication. I will oftentimes recommend a gluten-free, dairy-free, elimination diet. We may do a trial of that, especially if there is some concern about leaky gut. Then we are trying to do some gut healing.
To me, then we need to eliminate all of the major things that could be exacerbating the inflammation while we give the gut time to heal. Because there is such a high prevalence of Celiac in people who have diabetes and people who have autoimmune thyroid disease. For one, they have to get tested. It may co-exist. If they have Celiac, then it’s 100% no gluten. Sometimes, there is no gluten even in your skin products or other kinds of things.
The question comes down to: Is this a forever diet versus a temporary one? Then it comes down to how does the patient respond to me when they reintroduce it after being off it for 8-12 weeks? When we think their gut is healed? I listen to the patient. I always tell my patients that I am not just treating a lab or a number on the paper, even if it’s a food sensitivity test. We always have to look at the patients and what their responses are.
Dr. Eric:
I look at it that way, too, as more of an elimination diet, not a forever diet. With the nightshades, definitely. With dairy, I can’t say I have been dairy-free. I dealt with Graves’ in 2008 and have been in remission since 2009. I can’t say that I never have a dairy.
I can’t say that I have been 100% gluten-free, where I haven’t had any gluten or cross-contamination. If you have Celiac, you want to be super strict. If you don’t have Celiac, there are some people who choose not to completely 100% avoid gluten even if they don’t have Celiac. There is no need for us to have gluten. Some will say it’s playing with fire if you have a history of autoimmunity. Even if you don’t have Celiac, it could cause problems because it could potentially cause permeability of the gut.
To me, it does depend on the person. For the most part, I am gluten-free just because like you, I am eating whole, healthy foods. If you are eating whole, healthy foods, you are typically avoiding gluten. I can’t say I haven’t fallen off the wagon every now and then. It sounds like you maybe share the same thoughts. Some people, if they don’t have Celiac, might be okay if they occasionally get exposed to gluten. It’s not going to be a problem with everybody.
Dr. Melinda:
Whole grains are very healthy. It’s not just quantity; it’s also quality. You’ve probably had reports of this, too. People go to Europe and are eating Italian pasta and bread, and they’re like, “I have no issues here.” They come back here and then aahh. Some of it might be pesticides and not necessarily the gluten itself.
I have patients who are eliminated, and they feel great. Then they have no desire to do it. Then they know, “If I go and eat this birthday cake, I won’t feel so great the next day, but I’m not causing permanent harm.” I have others who have families, and it’s just easier for them. They don’t feel differently after doing an elimination diet. For them, it’s fine to keep it in moderation. I think I’m a little more lenient on those.
Nightshades, same thing. They have alkaloids in them. Some people do have reactions to them. Those tomatoes and peppers, all those bright colors, lycopene, have such health benefits with those polyphenols that I hate to cut out a whole category unless someone clearly has a reaction to it.
This is where I get into testing and seeing what’s going on when you’re eating those things. If we eliminate them, and you get better, then you are reacting to them perhaps.
Dr. Eric:
You also mentioned the quality, which is important. Someone might say, “Well, I went out to eat, and I had a gluten-free pizza.” I also used non-dairy cheese like Daiya. There is probably glyphosate in whatever dough they’re using. Also, the oils that they’re using are probably not the healthiest. Some people get so caught up on gluten and dairy and other allergens but don’t look at what kind of oils they are cooking with. That’s not good for you.
It’s one of those things where people want to live and go out to eat. Same thing. Every now and then, I want to go out to eat. I can’t say I’m perfect all the time. Some people get so caught up on gluten-free, dairy-free and overlook other sources.
Dr. Melinda:
Other aspects of the diet. It’s like when you go back to the ‘70s and ‘80s when fat was evil. Everybody was like, “I’m eating healthy. I’m eating all of these fat-free Snackwell cookies.” Of course, what happened? Now we have this sugar/diabesity epidemic.
What are people replacing gluten with? If they’re eating all of these gluten-free cookies and other gluten-free processed foods, that’s not moving in the right direction for sure. I would rather have somebody have a clean, whole-wheat piece of bread than gluten-free cookies full of sugar and processed vegetable oil. But that’s me.
Dr. Eric:
Good point. You can get the Ezekiel bread, like the ancient grains, organic. Is that worse? That’s not gluten-free. Is that worse than eating gluten-free Oreos? Who knows what else they have? There Are healthier gluten-free cookies that are dairy-free and have everything natural. That would be a more interesting conversation, I guess.
As far as comparing, I would go with the Ezekiel bread. Maybe taste-wise, people would prefer Oreos. Who knows what else is in that Oreo though?
Dr. Melinda:
You have to look at the whole thing. If you’re doing whole foods, that’s one thing. We’re running into the same thing with the plant substitutes, like Beyond Meat and other kinds of things that are just rich in saturated fat. Whenever you try to eliminate and replace, and an industry makes something that’s artificial, it never turns out well down the road.
Dr. Eric:
Definitely agree. How about oxalates? I interviewed Sally K. Norton, who wrote the book Toxic Superfoods on oxalates. There is at least one lab, Great Plains, who is now Mosaic Diagnostics, that does urinary testing for oxalates. You can’t completely eliminate them. Are you concerned at all about really high oxalate foods, like spinach or Swiss chard?
Dr. Melinda:
It’s a bigger category, too. Yes, spinach, kale, beans, chocolate. Chocolate has oxalates.
Dr. Eric:
Sweet potatoes, yeah.
Dr. Melinda:
This whole idea of these anti-nutrients. Back to the gut. Do the oxalates irritate the gut lining in some people, causing leaky gut? Some of it may be gut. There are some studies about oxalate affecting some of our immune cells, these monocytes and macrophages and having them release pro-inflammatory cytokines and chemokines.
What can I say? I think it’s an individual sensitivity. Those foods are healthy in general. Traditionally, we’ve always thought of oxalate elimination for people who have kidney stones. The question is: Do others need to? I just recommend balance.
This is where I think people get nutrition confusion. They will be told, “Eat a low oxalate diet.” What’s a lower oxalate diet? Broccoli. “But I can’t eat cruciferous vegetables because I was told they have goitrogens in them. I can’t eat oxalates, and I can’t eat goitrogens. I can’t eat gluten, and I can’t eat dairy.” Then they end up on a super restricted diet and get malnourished. They don’t enjoy food and have orthorexia.
For me, it will usually come back to moderation. If somebody is not eating handfuls of spinach and kale every day, then I’m not going to eliminate it from their diet.
Dr. Eric:
I agree. I used to say I stuff my smoothie with spinach. Then I randomly did an organic acids test that showed I had high urinary oxalates. That was one of the major changes I made. Not to say I will never have spinach, but if there are other substitutes for spinach.
I can’t say I tell people not to eat sweet potatoes, dark chocolate. It’s difficult. Like you said, when combined with other foods, you could end up with hardly anything to eat, with oxalates, lectins, goitrogens, and other compounds.
Dr. Melinda:
It’s individual. We have to remember that we have different genes. Some people have a gene that may lead to a problem with oxalate breakdown. They do have a problem with it. Maybe that, too.
You saw on the test that you had high oxalates in your urine. That doesn’t mean everybody has that. It also relates to the gut and the gut microbiome because the gut bacteria are involved in how we metabolize things. Our nutrient status involves how we counteract oxalates. It’s so complex that any broad generalization always turns me off.
Dr. Eric:
I get it.
Dr. Melinda:
I like that you tested. That’s the answer. You individualize it to you, and you know. That’s really the best. If patients have access to integrative/functional medicine practitioners who can help refine what they need, that’s always going to be the best.
Dr. Eric:
Even in my situation, I cut out the spinach, but I can’t say I really made a lot of other changes. When I did a retest, the levels dropped significantly. They were within the normal limits. According to Sally K. Norton, that might not mean someone still doesn’t have oxalates. On the test itself, it still looked a lot better without the spinach. It’s not like I cut out sweet potatoes. It’s not like I wasn’t eating any nuts and seeds. The spinach is one of the higher ones. I’m not saying never to eat spinach. I was just loading my smoothies with spinach every single day. Just like you said, everything in moderation.
Dr. Melinda:
Moderation is my mantra.
Dr. Eric:
Before we wrap things up, I did want to talk about seafood. Besides philosophical reasons, I have concerns about the environment, not just heavy metals, but PCBs. Do you also have those concerns? If someone says, “I want to have fish,” would you say, “Maybe have it, but in moderation?” 2-3 days a week than every single day because of concerns.
Dr. Melinda:
If there is one category beyond- I’m sure you’ve seen this. There are the roots; that’s the best. Have a lot of roots. Fish is the next category. Then you stay away from the two-legs and four-legs. They get progressively worse. I tend to say if you are going to have some fish, especially those Omega-3 fatty fish in moderation, that can be a healthy part of an anti-inflammatory diet. Like you said, not a lot of high mercury fish. Get good quality. Don’t overdo it. In moderation.
Dr. Eric:
Excellent. Anything else that you wanted me to ask you that I didn’t ask you?
Dr. Melinda:
Riff on anything? No. I think people with autoimmune disease, thyroid disease, we’re gaining a better understanding of different medications that can be beneficial, different alternative treatments like LDN.
Here is a more eloquent way of saying it: I have some patients who come in and say, “I don’t feel well. I need to change my thyroid medication.” Or, “I’m not feeling well. I think we need to tweak my thyroid medication.” Sometimes, that’s the case.
But a lot of times, it’s these other things, like lifestyle and diet and stress and not getting enough sleep. Those are the things that are the factor, not finding that magical proportion of T3/T4. That’s the bottom line. Sometimes, that helps, but ultimately, you need to have a great base for your lifestyle.
Dr. Eric:
It’s amazing that you do that. A lot of medical doctors would just adjust the thyroid medication, and that’s it. It’s great that you obviously incorporate all the diet and lifestyle stuff that we’ve been chatting about here.
Can you let people know where they can find out more about you? Share anything you’d like, like your website and any place people can find you.
Dr. Melinda:
My best place is my link in bio, since it has links to everything. DrMelindaRing.com has links to free downloads on anti-inflammatory culinary medicine; a little booklet I created; my Instagram; my website at Northwestern; and all kinds of things. Just go to DrMelindaRing.com, and they can link to whatever they like.
Dr. Eric:
You’re on YouTube and TikTok?
Dr. Melinda:
A little bit. I’m not so consistent. I need to get better.
Dr. Eric:
That’s okay. I’m on YouTube, but as of recording this, I haven’t done any TikTok videos yet, so that’s okay.
Thank you, Dr. Melinda. It was a great conversation. Appreciate you being open and honest about everything. I agree with what you said: Moderation is the key as we all know, but we sometimes lose sight of that. Thank you so much for your time.
Dr. Melinda:
Yeah, I enjoyed it. Thanks, Eric. Have a great day.
Dr. Eric:
You, too. Thank you.